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Re: Playing fair and ethically

By WarEagle
8/05/2016 11:11 am
GrandadB wrote:
They dont have an LDE! 4 MLBs all rated in the 50s!! , their Safeties are pitiful, and they only have one of each! I mean cmon! something really stinks here.


That doesn't mean anything. Plenty of times I play my RDEs at LDE without officially changing their position. Same thing goes for LBs and DBs.

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By blackflys
8/05/2016 12:52 pm
I think what grandad is referring to by trades that don't make sense for NO or Pitt over the last few seasons have to do with draft pics.

Trades with Pitt
Chi trades 4-16, 7, 6, 6 For 3-1, 6
Chi trades 3, 6, 7 for 3
Chi trades 1, 2 for 1,2,4,5. Pitt was 2-4 chi was 5-1 when trade made
Chi trades 2-29 , 2, 3,4 for 2-1, 2, 3
Chi trades 1,2 for 1,2,3,5
Chi trades 1-32 ,3-10 for 1-1
Chi trades 1,4,5 for 1 in 2028 season

2 trades with NO other then almost retired players
Chi trades 5-23, 6-23, 7-23 for 3-6
Chi trades 1-32, 2-32, 6-32 7-32 for 1-6, 2-7

All I can say is good job by Chicago. With that said it's completely legal and he did nothing wrong but you can't justify these trades . It's more Pitt and NO fault then anyone's. I know I have made a deal or two like this and then went back and gave the team I traded with another trade which benefited him because I felt horrible after.

Like I said Bling hasn't done anything wrong except exploit new coaches. If he can feel alright with it then what can we do but forget about it and figure out ways to beat his teams .. It's possible

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By Brrexkl
8/05/2016 1:58 pm
blackflys wrote:
I
Trades with Pitt
Chi trades 4-16, 7, 6, 6 For 3-1, 6
(Okay, so he moves up from the Mid 4th to Top 3rd, and pays a 7th and Two 6th's to do so. How much should it cost to move to the Top of the 3rd from the Middle of the 4th? I wouldn't have done the deal, but it doesn't seem completely unreasonable.)

Chi trades 3, 6, 7 for 3
(This one is even more reasonable, paying a 6th and 7th to simply move up in the SAME ROUND.)

Chi trades 1, 2 for 1,2,4,5. Pitt was 2-4 chi was 5-1 when trade made
(This one makes no sense to me. Why would Pitt give a 4th and 5th to move DOWN in the 1st and 2nd? Also, were the Chi 1st and 2nd actually Chicago's, or acquired from other Teams?)

Chi trades 2-29 , 2, 3,4 for 2-1, 2, 3
(Again, adds a 3rd and 4th to swap spots in the 2nd.)

Chi trades 1,2 for 1,2,3,5
(Would need more information on both Team Rosters to understand this one.)

Chi trades 1-32 ,3-10 for 1-1
(Usually this should cost more to move up 31 Spots... when was this trade done? During the Draft, or in the Season before Records were fully known?)

Chi trades 1,4,5 for 1 in 2028 season
(Once again, how much SHOULD it cost to Flip 1st Round Picks? He IS paying a Premium here.)

2 trades with NO other then almost retired players
Chi trades 5-23, 6-23, 7-23 for 3-6
(A stretch, but some Coaches value having Quantity Picks over Quality... if you can hit those 5th, 6ths and 7ths then this deal works. I can't, some can.)

Chi trades 1-32, 2-32, 6-32 7-32 for 1-6, 2-7
(I'd need more to flip, again also need to know WHEN the Trade occurred. You can generally expect Bling to be a 'Play Off Pick', but if the guy picking 6th was closer to 16th at the time of the Trade, it's not so bad.)

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By lellow2011
8/05/2016 2:48 pm
Brrexkl wrote:
blackflys wrote:
I
Trades with Pitt
Chi trades 4-16, 7, 6, 6 For 3-1, 6
(Okay, so he moves up from the Mid 4th to Top 3rd, and pays a 7th and Two 6th's to do so. How much should it cost to move to the Top of the 3rd from the Middle of the 4th? I wouldn't have done the deal, but it doesn't seem completely unreasonable.)

Chi trades 3, 6, 7 for 3
(This one is even more reasonable, paying a 6th and 7th to simply move up in the SAME ROUND.)

Chi trades 1, 2 for 1,2,4,5. Pitt was 2-4 chi was 5-1 when trade made
(This one makes no sense to me. Why would Pitt give a 4th and 5th to move DOWN in the 1st and 2nd? Also, were the Chi 1st and 2nd actually Chicago's, or acquired from other Teams?)

Chi trades 2-29 , 2, 3,4 for 2-1, 2, 3
(Again, adds a 3rd and 4th to swap spots in the 2nd.)

Chi trades 1,2 for 1,2,3,5
(Would need more information on both Team Rosters to understand this one.)

Chi trades 1-32 ,3-10 for 1-1
(Usually this should cost more to move up 31 Spots... when was this trade done? During the Draft, or in the Season before Records were fully known?)

Chi trades 1,4,5 for 1 in 2028 season
(Once again, how much SHOULD it cost to Flip 1st Round Picks? He IS paying a Premium here.)

2 trades with NO other then almost retired players
Chi trades 5-23, 6-23, 7-23 for 3-6
(A stretch, but some Coaches value having Quantity Picks over Quality... if you can hit those 5th, 6ths and 7ths then this deal works. I can't, some can.)

Chi trades 1-32, 2-32, 6-32 7-32 for 1-6, 2-7
(I'd need more to flip, again also need to know WHEN the Trade occurred. You can generally expect Bling to be a 'Play Off Pick', but if the guy picking 6th was closer to 16th at the time of the Trade, it's not so bad.)


For reference Pitts roster is awful and he just traded away what talent he did have after swapping those picks. So he gives up his high picks for low picks and then trades away what top end players he did have? This is why people are wondering about collusion. A 4th and a 5th to swap 1st rounders is not a premium when it's painfully obvious one you're going to be moving from a bottom 5 pick to a top 5 pick, that should cost at least 2 first rounders if not more. It can't all be blamed on KOB though, Pitt accepted these trades as well.

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By parsh
8/05/2016 4:23 pm
I think the accusation at this point is they are colluding.

I know briefly I was in CST 17 and it seemed 2 or 3 times daily I was receiving trade offers from KoB .. I had a bad team, he wanted the picks now and future knowing I'd probably have bad picks. I knew what he was trying to do .. just got tired of all the offers and my inbox blowing up with offers that made no sense. Can't block trade offers so I did the next best thing .. left.

That's my ultimate suggestion to the OP .. if players like that annoy you there's plenty of other leagues to choose from OR click on their past teams and grab an old one! Lol

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By GrandadB
8/05/2016 6:00 pm
True as far as putting another player at LDE, like RDE or DT or LB, that is not his regular position. That would make sense if he had someone decent to put in there, he doesnt! What I believe after all the discussion and analysis at this point, is that there is not really an "active" manager/owner of Pittsburgh. Do you understand what I am saying here? Is the only reason that jl1980 is playing this game for 6 seasons now is to get worse??? Consistently trade away your 90 rated players and picks? Seriously?

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By GrandadB
8/05/2016 6:21 pm
Chipped wrote:
GrandadB wrote:
OK, I found it Brex, thanks. Take a look at it and see what you think... Pittsburgh sends: Timothy Dew (CB) 2030 Round 3 Atlanta sends: 2028 Round 1 (Tampa Bay) 2029 Round 2 (Atlanta) 2030 Round 1 (Atlanta)


Looks like a legitimate trade to me. I'd do it both ways; I'd trade the CB if I was rebuilding and he's going to be retired by the time the team is competitive, and trade the picks if I was on the verge of a championship.

Such a trade doesn't look unbalanced at first glance. It's not blatant fleecing, and it's not my fault if you can't use the CB that I traded you properly, or fail to draft good players with the picks you get from me.

Suspicions of collusion should be investigated. If two teams are making very unbalanced trades then by all means raise the alarm. But that doesn't mean you should make it harder for good owners to obtain the assets they value. Owners value assets differently based on their particular situation, and you shouldn't stop them from trading/obtaining assets that they value at a cost they're okay with.

No one tells the Patriots they can't pick up players anymore just because they have a knack for developing underperforming players that were cut. At the same time, allegations of tampering are investigated carefully by the NFL. We shouldn't make it harder for good, legitimate owners to get what they want, or accuse them of gaming the system just because they succeed more. At the same time, we should crack down on those suspected of cheating.


Totally agree Chip about not making it harder for ethical, good owners to make legit trades, but in this particular example of Dew from SF to Pitt to Atlanta, there is also a strong possibility that the two teams in question with miserable won/loss records (SF & Pitt) are not actually being managed, as there is no improvement or progress to show in their teams or performance after having several seasons of experience. The owners do not appear to be "active" and actually playing the game. If that is the case, what should be done about it? Cudos to those like Bling who continually fleece this type of situation in several leagues, if he can find them, and he obviously does based on the amount of time and effort he must put in on this game, then its OK, right? What do you do about an owner who has a friend or relative sign on specifically for the purpose of setting up a "dummy" team? One that you can fleece and use on a regular basis? I dont see a way of preventing that, only recognizing a pattern when one or more players is gaining a very obvious advantage. Best way I can see to prevent that is through trade value restrictions. We should not be put at a disadvantage due to another player either not really playing the game, or for whatever reason, makes a highly unbalanced trade.

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By GrandadB
8/05/2016 6:40 pm
blackflys wrote:
I think what grandad is referring to by trades that don't make sense for NO or Pitt over the last few seasons have to do with draft pics.

Trades with Pitt
Chi trades 4-16, 7, 6, 6 For 3-1, 6
Chi trades 3, 6, 7 for 3
Chi trades 1, 2 for 1,2,4,5. Pitt was 2-4 chi was 5-1 when trade made
Chi trades 2-29 , 2, 3,4 for 2-1, 2, 3
Chi trades 1,2 for 1,2,3,5
Chi trades 1-32 ,3-10 for 1-1
Chi trades 1,4,5 for 1 in 2028 season

2 trades with NO other then almost retired players
Chi trades 5-23, 6-23, 7-23 for 3-6
Chi trades 1-32, 2-32, 6-32 7-32 for 1-6, 2-7

All I can say is good job by Chicago. With that said it's completely legal and he did nothing wrong but you can't justify these trades . It's more Pitt and NO fault then anyone's. I know I have made a deal or two like this and then went back and gave the team I traded with another trade which benefited him because I felt horrible after.

Like I said Bling hasn't done anything wrong except exploit new coaches. If he can feel alright with it then what can we do but forget about it and figure out ways to beat his teams .. It's possible


I agree Black, especially so if these two teams are being "actively" managed. But, there's a good possibility that they are not. And worse yet, it is possible that they are actually being managed by another player in that league, especially the one that is receiving the most benefit from the trades. If true, then that is a major problem. However, if they are really being managed by an independent thinking player who is actively playing the game and trying to improve the team, then I am truly amazed at their incredible lack of progress that is reflected in 1. their rosters 2. their trades and 3. their won/loss records. Even a team that has no owner, using the AI, wins a few games. Which brings up another subject. Stats being beefed up by rolling up big scores on non-managed teams, or on team controlled by another in the league, where the game plan and rules are set up for a blowout. Thoughts?

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By GrandadB
8/06/2016 8:20 am
Just looked at a trade in my league from today that I would use as an example of what is equal value & fair, with a good chance to improve both teams, and involves "blue chippers" and draft choices. There isnt a hint of collusion or unfairness to either team and the league.

https://cust17.myfootballnow.com/forums/thread/1/325?page=1#569

Last edited at 8/06/2016 8:22 am

Re: Playing fair and ethically

By IHP3
8/06/2016 11:03 am
Grandad, apparently you missed the boat. The point of trading is to improve your team and to try and win it all. You are not there to strengthen your opponent, that would be a stupid goal.
Stop with all the complaining. By your own admission you are new here, (though that seems unlikely given the nature of some of your comments) and yet you are looking to overhaul the game and create Mr. Roger's neighborhood.

This is a frickin online football game where the goal for most of us is to win. Stop complaining about teams making trades to improve them and not trying to beef up their foes. You are ripping Bling, one of the best owners in the game. At the same time, you are trying to create a game of Socialistic teams.

Go away, this game doesn't need that kind of homogenizing. I'm reading this, Lord only know why, and thinking, this guy can't be serious. No one in their right mind tries to get anything less than the best value possible for THEIR team. It is up to you to look out for your own best interests. This is a game of competition. You play fair and at the same time, you play to win!

Stop your soapbox complaining and play the game!!!